Info: Cloud computing

[sahel]

I started a topic once about Cloud Computing on Entropiaforum.
This website seems to be the place to post about it though, since other games might use cloud computing way before EU might do.


It started begin this year when AMD released news about plans to build a 'cloud supercomputer for rendering graphics'.

In March at the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco, the company OnLive revealed plans for a cloud computing service that should start to roll out in the USA in 2010. Interesting articles about it here and here.

At the same time the dutch company Gaikai also came out with plans for cloud computing.

Then a few days ago Sony registered the name 'PS Cloud' as a trademark.


As I said in my original thread, cloud computing is hot right now, and I think we can see some fast developments in this market. I made this thread to post news about this subject and to discuss. Feel free to join .

[711]

Very interesing sahel.

For as long as computers have existed, gaming has been one of the main driving forces behind advancements in computer hardware, software and performance.

I think virtual worlds, especially those with hopes of accomodating very large numbers of simultaneous users in a singlular virtual universe (i.e. EVE or Entropia Universe), are similarly a powerful driving force for enhancements in server architecture and parallel computing.

P.S. there is a dedicated forum for discussions relating to game engines and technology: Game Technology, so I have moved your thread there.

[XingTianNu]

Is kind how Internet started, compiuters linked betwine them.
The idea look more like the actual ( cable TV in some countrys ) you browse the movie you like to see and look it on the server ( mine cable TV screen look familiar to the SS on the first article ).
I doubt that it will be as fast as LAN ot local hosted files ( cant seem to find reason why it will be as fast while many ppl will conect in same time to remote servers ).
But the tehnology it self can be something new cant realy juge from articles live test will only prove it good or bad.
If you live in Japan you will see this kind news ( high tek ) every month, but only few projects work out at the and.

[waperboy]

Very interesting concept, although I don't see it used for desktop pc graphics rendering en-masse.

Anything to do with massive paralellism I find quite interesting, (former) computer geek as I am (was )

[sahel]

Thanks for placing it in the right section 711, i'll have to get used again to all the sections .

The big question for me is indeed the response time that will be needed if full hd graphics are to be streamed to the client computers. The Onlive service seem to have dealt with that problem if we may believe the company, but I wonder how and if they can make their promises come true.

Whenever news pops up about this subject i'll post it here.

[AetasSerenus]

Cloud Computing is indeed quite intriguing, I really can imagine a future where 'computers' really are nothing but screens (or other information projecting devices, be it connected directly into our visual cortex, or other) with inbuilt receivers connected to gigantic supercloudclusters, hosted and owned, perhaps by the gaming companies themselves, or perhaps by companies set up for that sole purpose..

This would effectively bring an end to pirating games, as no software exists on ones own platform, and therefore there is nothing to illegally copy and distribute, and I do think breaking the access system to these SCCs might be something that is somewhat hard to achieve.

This would mean that everyone would have access to life-like graphics and probably also the crash of the personal computing business , if they do not adapt to build clusters..
As I do think that even companies might move over to Clouds, perhaps big ones having their own, working somewhat like a mainframe but handling whatever rendering and computing needs the company might have.

There might be remnants of the old computers though, only used in locations where connection to an established cloud is not possible, and building one is uneconomical..

[sahel]

I noticed that the NewsBot picked up something about OnLive.

OnLive could threaten Xbox, PS3, and Wii


For the lazy:

Originally Posted by http://news.cnet.com/onlive-could-threaten-xbox-ps3-and-wii/

OnLive could threaten Xbox, PS3, and Wii
by Daniel Terdiman

The OnLive system will be shown with 16 games from a series of major publishers during the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco this week. OnLive is aiming to upset the traditional video game business model.
(Credit: OnLive)

SAN FRANCISCO--Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo, look out. Your traditional video game console business model may be in danger.

It's too early to tell how much danger, of course, but a start-up called OnLive announced a brand-new game distribution system Monday night that, if it works as planned, could change the games game forever.

OnLive, which was started by WebTV founder Steve Perlman and former Eidos CEO Mike McGarvey, is aiming to launch a system--seven years in the works--that will digitally distribute first-run, AAA games from publishers like Electronic Arts, Take-Two, Ubisoft, Atari, and others, all at the same time as those titles are released into retail channels. The system is designed to allow players to stream on-demand games at the highest quality onto any Intel-based Mac or PC running XP or Vista, regardless of how powerful the computer.

The system will also stream games directly to a TV via a small plug-in device, and players can use a custom wireless controller as well as VoIP headsets in conjunction with it.

The OnLive system includes the ability to use wireless controllers similar to those available for standard console systems like the Xbox or PS3. It also has a small micro-console that will allow games to be streamed directly to a TV.
(Credit: OnLive)

Based here in San Francisco, OnLive timed its formal unveiling to this week's Game Developers Conference, where it will be showcasing the technology and 16 initial games it will launch with.

The service is currently in a closed beta, but is expected to go into a public beta this summer, and to launch this winter.

According to Perlman, OnLive's technology will make it possible to stream the games in such a manner--high quality, no matter what kind of system the user has--by virtue of a series of patented and patent-pending compression technologies. And instead of requiring users to download the games, OnLive will host them all and stream them from a series of the highest-end servers. Users will have only to download a 1MB plug-in to get the service up and running.

OnLive is hoping to capture a significant portion of the video game market share. In February, the industry posted one of its strongest months ever, with total sales of $1.47 billion, up 10 percent from a year ago. And in February, the Xbox, PS3 and Wii accounted for total sales of 1.42 million units.

The OnLive system aims to bring cost-efficient instant and high-quality video games streamed to Macs and PCs.
(Credit: OnLive)

An intended benefit of this infrastructure, Perlman and McGarvey explained, is that users will be able to play streamed games via OnLive with no lag, so long as their Internet connections meet minimum thresholds. For standard-definition play, that would mean a minimum 1.5 Mbps connection, and for high-def, 5 Mbps.

That's obviously an essential feature, as it's hard to imagine anyone paying for a service like OnLive, no matter what games are on offer, if the user experience is inadequate. But the company promises that as long as users have the requisite minimum hardware, operating systems, and Internet connections, they should be able to have seamless play.

The upshot of this infrastructure model, Perlman said, is that OnLive is somewhat future-proof, meaning that players won't have to upgrade anything to keep on playing games on the system years into the future. Instead, the upgrades will happen on the back-end, with the company regularly boosting the power of the servers it uses to host and stream the games.

And while demos always have to be taken with a grain of salt, CNET News did see a real-time presentation of OnLive on at least two different computers and on a HD TV. Game play was as smooth and lag-free as advertised

So far, OnLive has yet to make its business model public, but what seems likely is some form of subscription service, where players will pay a monthly access fee and then pay additional costs, depending on whether they want to play games once, or buy them for permanent play.

The company also said that it will probably offer free trials of some or all of the games it offers, allowing consumers to decide whether they want to buy. OnLive recognizes that some players may use those trials as a way of deciding whether to buy such games from traditional retail stores, but Perlman and McGarvey suggested that as long as people are interacting with the OnLive system, they'll be happy.

It's clear that OnLive is modeling its system at least somewhat after Microsoft's hit Xbox Live service. So fans of multiplayer games won't be on their own. Rather, they'll have full access to multiplayer features of games built for them. And another interesting social feature is one that will allow users to digitally watch others play games in real time. The company thinks that users will find it exciting to watch the best players in action, even if they themselves are only kibitzing.

Perlman said that the concept of spectating in online game systems is, in and of itself, not new, but that OnLive presents the first time players will be able to look in on what others are playing without owning the games themselves.

Another social feature in the Xbox Live mold is what are called "brag clips." These are essentially 15-second replays of game action that players can share with friends if they want to show off their prowess. This is possible, Perlman said, because OnLive is continually recording the last 15 seconds of action.

The OnLive system includes social features such as 'brag clips,' which allow players to share 15-second videos of game action they want to brag about.
(Credit: OnLive)

All told, McGarvey said, OnLive offers a full suite of standard social features including friends, clans, rankings, leader boards, tournaments and more.

From the outset, OnLive isn't partnering with any of the first-party publishers--Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo, meaning that franchises like "Halo" or "Zelda" won't be available. And that makes sense, since those companies are hardly likely to want to sign up with a company whose very technology may obviate their longstanding business models.

That means, Perlman and McGarvey acknowledged, that many players who sign up for OnLive's service will still maintain their consoles, and continue to buy games for them. At least for the rest of the current generation of machines, they said. But come the next generation, all bets are off, they said.

And for the nine--to date--third-party publishers who have committed to being involved, McGarvey said, OnLive presents a much more efficient and profitable distribution model than the standard retail structure. That's because the system is all digital, cutting down on physical distribution costs, and because it is designed to eradicate piracy and second-hand sales, both of which are banes of the publishers' existence.

Indeed, McGarvey said that OnLive has gotten strong commitments of titles from the nine publishers. That means, added Perlman, that the planned launch this winter could be accompanied by the most titles of any new gaming system launch in history.

In addition, McGarvey said publishers are eager for the kind of raw data that OnLive can provide about players' usage of the games, including whether they like or dislike games, how much they play, how they play and so on. That data is hard for publishers to collect with traditional consoles, he argued.

Clearly, OnLive has set an ambitious goal: dethroning the console makers as the game industry's kings. And as is always the case with brand-new and publicly unavailable technology, it is far too early to know whether the company or the service can live up to that goal. But if its demo is any indication, OnLive is definitely onto something, and given that the company has been in stealth mode for so many years, it's possible that the console makers will be caught off guard.

[thoreau]

As I posted in another thread - there are serious doubts whether this could ever work.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/gd...y-work-article

It sounds brilliant, but there's one rather annoying fact to consider: the nature of video compression is such that the longer the CPU has to encode the video, the better the job it will do. Conversely, it's a matter of fact that the lower the latency, the less efficient it can be.

More than that, OnLive overlord Steve Perlmen has said that the latency introduced by the encoder is 1ms. Think about that; he's saying that the OnLive encoder runs at 1000fps. It's one of the most astonishing claims I've ever heard. It's like Ford saying that the new Fiesta's cruising speed is in excess of the speed of sound. To give some idea of the kind of leap OnLive reckons it is delivering, I consulted one of the world's leading specialists in high-end video encoding, and his response to OnLive's claims included such gems as "Bulls***" and "Hahahahaha!" along with a more measured, "I have the feeling that somebody is not telling the entire story here." This is a man whose know-how has helped YouTube make the jump to HD, and whose software is used in video compression applications around the world.

[sahel]

Originally Posted by thoreau

As I posted in another thread - there are serious doubts whether this could ever work.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/gd...y-work-article

Ah yeah, that's one of the articles I refer to in my op. Certainly a good sceptical look on the problems that are connected to onlive's service. The more I wonder if OnLive can hold their promises .

[thoreau]

Aside from processing graphics in the cloud - I wonder what other CPU tasks can be performed outside my PC box.

How long before my 'computer' is simply a screen with some sort of wireless network card?

All the software would reside in the cloud. All my data stored in the cloud. CPU intensive things could be performed in the cloud by renting out cycles from some vendor.

Yeah, soon the average consumer will only need a screen and network card. Everything else will be require a cloud account.